Ramp jumps

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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by adminless »

unlucky, ok, no problem then just to be safe (mostly for the events and so) I'll make it so that you can opt out. try tomorrow with the option setu cg_rampjump 0 in your cfg or just by doing \setu cg_rampjump "" and \cg_rampjump 0 in the console to disable them though as I told you in such case you're clearly gonna be at a disadvantage from the rest. keep in mind that what I showed is just the tip of the iceberg (i.e. what I could in a few days of testing based on my limited tester ability) the combinations and real potential is literally endless. yeah, you can just rocket jump there but thing is that you can rocket jump as well as time grenades and plasma ride all the same while double ramp jumping for never seen before maneuvers.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by ...jutuli... »

Tried, seems to not work properly. Still jumping like goat...
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Re: Ramp jumps

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...jutuli... wrote: Sat Apr 08, 2023 14:50 Tried, seems to not work properly. Still jumping like goat...
You guys all rubbish players. I haven't noticed anything

:crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy:
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Re: Ramp jumps

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@jutu for other than the first day (the evening of the Thursday 30 of March of 2023) where I guess that you typed (once) my commands manually you seem to be doing it wrong (or just not doing it at all). you obviously need to do \setu cg_rampjump "" and \cg_rampjump 0 every time you connect to the servers, it's not like it autosaves or something unless you add that (those commands) to your cfg/autoexec.cfg or by any other means as I said obviously.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by ...jutuli... »

Ah...sorry, I missunderstood it, I added command just to my config... Ill try again, thanks.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by RH »

So this "feature" finally found its way to the duel server. Really disappointed a choice to ruin the almost entirely vanilla duel server was made :(
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Re: Ramp jumps

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yes I added them there before as I think that it was missing there. in fact, after watch the previous round of duels I believe that they are there a lot more important there than on UnFreeZe as you can not (normally) rocket jump there.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by RH »

adminless wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 0:24 yes I added them there before as I think that it was missing there. in fact, after watch the previous round of duels I believe that they are there a lot more important there than on UnFreeZe as you can not (normally) rocket jump there.
It completely breaks positioning, flow of movement, and what is possible on maps. This only allows people to do tricks that don't add to the game, other than to piss off people who have played quake3 for years and expect it to work a certain way. Objectively bad decision for the duel server.

Rocket jumping is SUPPOSED to be a trade off. You trade stack for position.

These changes just show a complete lack of understanding of the game and its mechanics.
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Re: Ramp jumps

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dude you're so boring, rocket jumps are just supposed to be a trade off for vanilla settings to make up for the lack of proper physics (under normal circumstances). it's a fact that virtually all custom maps are indeed designed and optimized for those physics as I think that I documented across this own thread. furthermore some like the cpm ones are not even really (meant to be) "playable" otherwise while at the same time the standard ones get a overall nice update and improvement. for other than a few standard maps the majority of maps usually played at the duel server are indeed custom ones.

as I wrote just after referring one round at the masters event I immediately realized that this was clearly being missed there. I believe that after I added this to the "main" servers people have finally get used to it and therefor that's what they expect when they go there. anyways, not trying to sell you anything, if you just want 1999 canonical stuff you can just stick to the classic legacy masters server that I still run for the fans and skip this custom one. no big deal.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by RH »

adminless wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 9:06 dude you're so boring, rocket jumps are just supposed to be a trade off for vanilla settings to make up for the lack of proper physics (under normal circumstances). it's a fact that virtually all custom maps are indeed designed and optimized for those physics as I think that I documented across this own thread. furthermore some like the cpm ones are not even really (meant to be) "playable" otherwise while at the same time the standard ones get a overall nice update and improvement. for other than a few standard maps the majority of maps usually played at the duel server are indeed custom ones.

as I wrote just after referring one round at the masters event I immediately realized that this was clearly being missed there. I believe that after I added this to the "main" servers people have finally get used to it and therefor that's what they expect when they go there. anyways, not trying to sell you anything, if you just want 1999 canonical stuff you can just stick to the classic legacy masters server that I still run for the fans and skip this custom one. no big deal.
You speak about maps from a place lacking understanding of game mechanics with positioning and trade offs. This is very clear. You are the only person who thought it was missing and wanted this change, and you don't even play duel. Working within and understanding the limitations of the game is what separates good players from mediocre ones. The limitations of the game are GOOD and open up opportunities for both players. You are trying to follow the same path of cpma which targets an entirely different type of player than one who enjoys vanilla.

Basically everyone said they did not want this feature on unfreeze, but accepted it because its your own weird custom mod anyway. The duel server is different in that it was far closer to a vanilla experience in terms of gameplay.

Making things possible that were impossible before is NOT a good thing. It just changes the game, which for DUEL players is bad because it is expected that the game perform the same way as all the other vanilla duel servers. Duel is more serious of a game mode and players expect to be playing a certain rule set otherwise its not worth playing at all.

IMO this just ruined the duel server (more). Unfreeze people won't enjoy it, because they don't play duel anyway. Duel players won't enjoy it, because its no longer vanilla.

If you only want to see who is better at movement, then run a defrag server. If you only want to see who aims better while moving around, then just remove all the maps and force it to amphi/eye2eye. This is where you are trending anyway and as it stand the server is useless for duel.
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Re: Ramp jumps

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look buddy I speak about the maps from the point of view of the own original authors, no bullshit. from the own hub3aeroq3 unedited readme as-is just bolded in case you can't see it:
hubster wrote:TITLE : Aerowalk
FILENAME : hub3aeroq3.zip
AUTHOR : The Preacher (this conversion by the Hubster)
DATE : April 5 2001
TYPE : Tourney
EMAIL ADDRESS : hburji@hotmail.com
WEBSITE URL : http://hubster.challenge-au.com/
ZIPFILE CONTENTS : hub3aeroq3.pk3, hub3aeroq3.txt
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* LEVEL DESCRIPTION *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aerowalk was originally made by the Preacher, for Quake. A Quake II version was
released, by which time, Aerowalk had become a very popular duel level. Full
credits for design and ownership go to Preacher. Well done for making one of the
best custom levels of all time!

I have seen some versions of Aerowalk for Quake III Arena by others, however, I
didn't find that they did the map justice. Scaling is the biggest problem I
found with other versions, and so I set about setting my own solution to this.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* VERY IMPORTANT NOTES *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This version by myself is probably a "tighter" version than other Q3 ones. I did
this deliberately to speed up gameplay. Some items have been replaced with
stronger ones to aid in balancing out the weight of the railgun and red armour.

I have made this version with the features of the LATEST Challenge Promode Arena
mod in mind. Obtain the LATEST version from http://www.challenge-tv.com/


I HIGHLY suggest using \callvote armorsystem 3!!!

Please note that this map takes advantage of the new Jacket Armour present in
the LATEST VERSION of Challenge Promode Arena.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DEATHMATCH : 6 Player Respawn Points
TEAM DEATHMATCH : I think so, tell me what it's like?
SUGGESTED PLAYER LOAD : 2
DIFFICULTY SETTINGS : -
NEW TEXTURES : Yes
NEW SOUNDS : No
NEW MODELS : Yes... sort of anyway:-)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* CONSTRUCTION *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAP BASE : Conversion of the original Aerowalk.
: Rebuilt from scratch.
PREFABS USED : My own (for the Square Cylinder Arches)
EDITOR(S) USED : Q3radiant 202B3, GTK Radiant 1.1 TA Beta
OTHER UTILITIES USED : Photoshop, Editpad, Qase
KNOWN BUGS : None
COMPILE MACHINE : P3 600eMhz, 256MB RAM, GeForce DDR
BSP TIME : Approx 20 seconds
VIS TIME : Approx 4 minutes
LIGHT TIME : Approx 10 minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* CREDITS *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PREACHER: for building a map like this. It's a true piece of genious.

BANJO : for all his help. Item placements. Once again we have forged our
: strengths to deliver what we feel is another solid release.

CHWD : for making the BEST mod on the planet! Go CPMA!!!!!!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* COPYRIGHT / PERMISSIONS *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This LEVEL may be distributed ONLY over the Internet and/or BBS systems.
You are NOT authorized to put this LEVEL on any CD or distribute it in
any way without my written permission.

Quake III Arena (C) 1999 id Software. All rights reserved.
The Preacher (C). All rights reserved.
that's a fact and if you would have spent just little time wondering about the author intentions of many other maps you could easily tell that all tell the same history along the lines of Quake III Arena compatible map optimized and intended to be played with cpm physics so get your facts straight.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by RH »

adminless wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 13:25 look buddy I speak about the maps from the point of view of the own original authors, no bullshit. from the own hub3aeroq3 unedited readme as-is just bolded in case you can't see it:
hubster wrote:TITLE : Aerowalk
FILENAME : hub3aeroq3.zip
AUTHOR : The Preacher (this conversion by the Hubster)
DATE : April 5 2001
TYPE : Tourney
EMAIL ADDRESS : hburji@hotmail.com
WEBSITE URL : http://hubster.challenge-au.com/
ZIPFILE CONTENTS : hub3aeroq3.pk3, hub3aeroq3.txt
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* LEVEL DESCRIPTION *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aerowalk was originally made by the Preacher, for Quake. A Quake II version was
released, by which time, Aerowalk had become a very popular duel level. Full
credits for design and ownership go to Preacher. Well done for making one of the
best custom levels of all time!

I have seen some versions of Aerowalk for Quake III Arena by others, however, I
didn't find that they did the map justice. Scaling is the biggest problem I
found with other versions, and so I set about setting my own solution to this.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* VERY IMPORTANT NOTES *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This version by myself is probably a "tighter" version than other Q3 ones. I did
this deliberately to speed up gameplay. Some items have been replaced with
stronger ones to aid in balancing out the weight of the railgun and red armour.

I have made this version with the features of the LATEST Challenge Promode Arena
mod in mind. Obtain the LATEST version from http://www.challenge-tv.com/


I HIGHLY suggest using \callvote armorsystem 3!!!

Please note that this map takes advantage of the new Jacket Armour present in
the LATEST VERSION of Challenge Promode Arena.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DEATHMATCH : 6 Player Respawn Points
TEAM DEATHMATCH : I think so, tell me what it's like?
SUGGESTED PLAYER LOAD : 2
DIFFICULTY SETTINGS : -
NEW TEXTURES : Yes
NEW SOUNDS : No
NEW MODELS : Yes... sort of anyway:-)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* CONSTRUCTION *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAP BASE : Conversion of the original Aerowalk.
: Rebuilt from scratch.
PREFABS USED : My own (for the Square Cylinder Arches)
EDITOR(S) USED : Q3radiant 202B3, GTK Radiant 1.1 TA Beta
OTHER UTILITIES USED : Photoshop, Editpad, Qase
KNOWN BUGS : None
COMPILE MACHINE : P3 600eMhz, 256MB RAM, GeForce DDR
BSP TIME : Approx 20 seconds
VIS TIME : Approx 4 minutes
LIGHT TIME : Approx 10 minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* CREDITS *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PREACHER: for building a map like this. It's a true piece of genious.

BANJO : for all his help. Item placements. Once again we have forged our
: strengths to deliver what we feel is another solid release.

CHWD : for making the BEST mod on the planet! Go CPMA!!!!!!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* COPYRIGHT / PERMISSIONS *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This LEVEL may be distributed ONLY over the Internet and/or BBS systems.
You are NOT authorized to put this LEVEL on any CD or distribute it in
any way without my written permission.

Quake III Arena (C) 1999 id Software. All rights reserved.
The Preacher (C). All rights reserved.
that's a fact and if you would have spent just little time wondering about the author intentions of many other maps you could easily tell that all tell the same history along the lines of Quake III Arena compatible map optimized and intended to be played with cpm physics so get your facts straight.
CPM and VQ3 are not compatible. They target different kinds of players. If you want to just run a cpm server then do that instead of pretending to do otherwise. Just as magister stated previously in the thread, if I wanted to play cpm I'd just go play cpma. Many maps are made with CPM physics in mind and play COMPLETELY different without them. Pukka3tourney2 for example is basically two different maps depending if you play in cpm or in vq3. These maps DO NOT require cpm physics or any part of them to play good.

You are working from a place of complete ignorance in how vq3 duel was played and has been played for decades now.

CPM22 is also made by hub and is played by the CPM players. There is a reason vq3 players stuck with hub3aeroq3.

Server is already ruined, pointless to continue arguing. You obviously have no interest in what actual duel players think.
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Re: Ramp jumps

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as usual, that you prefer other settings, you do not like the changes or whatever, it's totally cool but that's a completely different history from trying to making it look like some maps that feature cpm textures and even cpm logos all over the place have in fact nothing to do with cpm and the changes are plain stupid (objectively speaking, not just from your point of view, that's it, that maps whose own authors clearly state themselves to be optimized and intended to be played with cpm settings are indeed totally not playable at all with cpm physics) it just make you look like a crazy man out of touch with the reality. one thing is that you prefer some settings over the others and/or to argue whether one could be better or worse than the other in a reasonable manner and another very different thing is just to flame and disqualify everything just because it doesn't go your way. clearly nobody said that it was going to play exactly the same but hey that's exactly the point when you change something so as said, if you looking strictly for 1999 canonical stuff just stick to the classic masters server and you'll be good. for the modern one I feel like these settings (and even according to the own map authors) are a better fit and more exciting. that's all.

anyways, just to be safe I also attach here the last batch of tests for this live at the duel server I just finished now on the most popular maps to make sure that everything works as it should.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by ...jutuli... »

RH wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 0:19 So this "feature" finally found its way to the duel server. Really disappointed a choice to ruin the almost entirely vanilla duel server was made :(
Just turn it off for yourself as I did. Not good "upgrade", but at least it can be disableable.
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Re: Ramp jumps

Post by RH »

adminless wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 16:48for the modern one I feel like these settings (and even according to the own map authors) are a better fit and more exciting. that's all.

anyways, just to be safe I also attach here the last batch of tests for this live at the duel server I just finished now on the most popular maps to make sure that everything works as it should.
1. You don't play duel, you do not know what makes for good duel games. Your constant poor takes regarding gameplay make me believe you have a minimal or even less understanding of the game at all. You are the same person who decided removing doors was better for gameplay without any understanding of the role that doors serve, and had to be corrected by the entire community and then still wouldn't admit you were wrong.

2. "more exiciting" to you just means more moving and shooting, that is not what why duel players play duel. Hal9000 is not the epitome of exciting quake and watching gameplay like that puts me to sleep. What you find "more exciting" is completely braindead and boring to me. Exciting to me is having a good strategy and executing on it flawlessly within the limitations of the game, not expanding the limits of the game just so I can show off a thousand defrag and aim trainer hours.

3. No shit cpm maps are made for cpm gameplay, that does NOT mean that they require cpm movement. The maps play DIFFERENT with vq3. I do NOT want to play duel on hub where people can 180 and double jump to red armor. If I wanted to play aerowalk with weird backwards double jumps to red armor and odd geometry skips then I would play cpma, not vq3. Map authors are NOT experts on gameplay. If you want to extend that logic out, then just REMOVE all strafe jumping because john carmack designed the game to be without it and is on record saying he hates it and wanted to remove it.

4. OBVIOUSLY adding a movement mechanic makes new jumps possible. THAT IS NOT THE POINT. Those jumps being impossible is GOOD for vq3 gameplay. Just because jumps are possible by adding movement mechanics, does not mean you need to add the movement mechanics. Again, by that logic, why not just give everyone no clip because then you can really do things that aren't possible in vanilla. Your logic for why the mechanic should be there is extremely weak and quite dumb.

5. You obviously just want cpm gameplay, so just cut the shit and delete the server and throw up a cpma server on the port.

I don't know why you hate quake3 duel so much that you have to change it into something different. Some people actually like quake3 duel and would prefer you not go around shitting on it.

Why the hell would anyone with any merit want to play on some random ass fucked up server where noobs can just fly around the map with no brain and end up in impossible positions. All these changes do is guarantee that nobody will take the server seriously and not a single good player will actually want to connect and play there.

You think you are an expert. You are not. You have an actual expert telling you that you are wrong, and you choose to just cite other non-expert opinions and continue to not know what you are talking about.
...jutuli... wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 18:25
RH wrote: Tue Jun 06, 2023 0:19 So this "feature" finally found its way to the duel server. Really disappointed a choice to ruin the almost entirely vanilla duel server was made :(
Just turn it off for yourself as I did. Not good "upgrade", but at least it can be disableable.
That is not a viable solution in a game mode centered around two players being given the same tools and seeing who plays better with them. "Do you want to disable cheats while your opponent can still cheat? Y/N"