Team UnFreeZe VS Diamond Clan - undisputed champions fight

[adminless]

ok guys it happened finally diamond completed a legendary come back from a 2:0 game to end up taking the undisputed tittle (and basically just proving right the flagrant fair-play/balance violation why they were removed from the regular competitions) in a fight that went the distance against a no less good team UnFreeZe that did it best, congrats undisputed champions and thank you for participating. to celebrate it yesterday Team UnFreeZe rehearsal already uploaded in YouTube and currently updating all the stats and videos for this so stay tuned.

[adminless]

ok, everything updated now unless I missed something, I guess I'll probably analyze it further tomorrow but a quick look returns some overall fairly balanced neck to neck scorecards with probably the only relevant difference lying in the thawing with 59:75 in favor of diamond where UnFreeZe thawing dedication probably lied slightly bellow the standard. overall the fight mostly consisted in two halves for each team, the first for UnFreeZe, the second for Diamond, with the key moment of the night being the third game that quite frankly it's difficult to understand/explain statistically speaking (that was an statistical upset) and that I'll make sure to review once it's done. as for the mvp of the event so nobody comes with any more crazy-making that I rip people off and that I give mvp's by the name, here are the individual results, so olc mvp of the event just with a single point of difference overall:

Code: Select all

+-----------------+-------+-------+-------+----------+--------+------+-------+
| player          | score | kills | thaws | suicides | deaths | eff  | games |
+-----------------+-------+-------+-------+----------+--------+------+-------+
| >!<olc          |    99 |    78 |    21 |        0 |     64 | 1.55 |     5 |
| oKo*WhoAmI?!    |    98 |    83 |    15 |        0 |     56 | 1.75 |     5 |
| >!<KF           |    93 |    80 |    13 |        0 |     68 | 1.37 |     5 |
| Miroslav        |    80 |    67 |    13 |        0 |     65 | 1.23 |     5 |
| [ILM]Blaze      |    68 |    60 |     8 |        0 |     57 | 1.19 |     4 |
| >!<HEERO-2B     |    61 |    49 |    12 |        0 |     50 | 1.22 |     4 |
| -=ASS=-Infin!ty |    57 |    44 |    13 |        0 |     46 | 1.24 |     4 |
| >!<Shantu       |    55 |    42 |    13 |        0 |     53 | 1.04 |     4 |
| fau             |    51 |    44 |     7 |        0 |     43 | 1.19 |     3 |
| aimer           |    42 |    36 |     6 |        0 |     39 | 1.08 |     3 |
| [ILM]Fus1on     |    27 |    23 |     4 |        0 |     29 | 0.93 |     2 |
| -=ASS=-RICKY!!! |    26 |    24 |     2 |        0 |     29 | 0.90 |     2 |
| [ILM]ironmonkey |    19 |    15 |     4 |        0 |     28 | 0.68 |     2 |
| >!<Viper++      |     7 |     6 |     1 |        0 |     14 | 0.50 |     1 |
| >!<FraG_MasiN?  |     7 |     5 |     2 |        0 |     15 | 0.47 |     1 |
+-----------------+-------+-------+-------+----------+--------+------+-------+

as said overall I think that it was that good so thank you everyone for participate.

[fau]

ggs, was fun to play together in unfreeze team and well played diamond clan

I'm not sure how I can explain our bal3 loss. Maybe the bad "rail staircase" spawn that happened to us few times and we started the round 4v5? Would be nice if it was possible to fix on this map in 5v5 (but I know spawn manipulation must be pretty hard). But also diamond played last 3 rounds exceptionally well, congratulations.

I just want to add for 1000th time that dm7 should be banned and removed from the face of earth just like dm11 did Spectators were leaving gtv out of boredom and players complained too.
Same with overkill with current item layout imo. Biggest map that's still fun to watch and play is something like 6++, 7++, teddm1, cpm4a or dcmap7.

[adminless]

I know, to be honest these teddm1 and cpm4a maps are also pretty trash. I mean, those maps are great to be played 10vs10 (or even more in those you can probably even go up to 15vs15) and/or in a more casual/fun/friendly manner (like the last immortal-moskva matchup for example that wasn't as competitive overall) in this specific mode but probably not that good for neck to neck competitive 5vs5 games like the ones here but it's what it's. otherwise you would just end up with teams claiming that the only reason why they didn't win was exclusively because such maps were not available so be it (i.e. no excuses, undisputed means undisputed). at the end of the day as I wrote in the quick review (and that even by now it stands as accurate) you can just take it as two home maps for each team (the halves) and then bal3dm3 as the tie-breaker regardless of the order. anyways this is another perfect example of why the legged format has been precisely introduced, to get rid of such fixed choices. the problem with pulling that off here is first that there was really no more time (the western Christmas holidays where people had committed to this are pretty much over) and that also takes a lot more commitment/time that for non regular teams like these it can also be a issue. as for 7++ pretty much of the same, don't think that because they didn't play the same level of defense there the other day against Moskva that map is significantly much better since the circumstances were totally different. it might be as much slightly better but for the most part is pretty much comparable. anyways as usual, thanks for the input and we'll see how it plays out for another event/tournament so stay tuned.

[kf]

first of all... good games, well played by all (besides one ofcourse)

i did not watch the games from gtv perspective yet, but i will later. since i saw that youre discussing a bit about maps and common playstyle i saw some stuff at discord where players call something like "unfreeze player tutorial" while olc just killed infinity at red, throwing his dead body fastest he can to stairs and starts spamming. well all players should start to think about the reason, why shouldnt he just spam this body? unfreeze was having red at this time and i remember that situation because you are forgetting my pov for example. i stood at back hallway and was railing your players while they just were running to that dead body trying to do something and getting railed by me like 4 or 5 times.
you talk about camping red? i want to remember that shantu and me just ran into 4 enemys by accident at first round at rocket ya, you were just defending such corpses instead of hunting with 4 players to red (you could have let your mvp stay there he even doesnt do anything else than camping and being a backward only )
or some other situation where you killed me at red because all of you were spawning there and i was just collecting red before you get it. you just stood there and what did you expect? that we attack red while we are 4v5 its your turn at such situation not ours. what happened? i just respawned and i guess we won the round, because you did nothing.
why did we had no problem to get red back the whole time? why did we even attacked you while we had red? did you just forget that or are you really blind?

how did you lose bal while you dealed 4k more dmg than us? easy to explain. NO FUCKING TEAMPLAY. its not about respawns or any other shit. you are always looking at stats and shit like kills dmg etc. that you just forget about the playstyles of players. if you only have lurkers which run away when they get attacked you cant stand a fight. you just took your list and took the best players of all teams in case of dmg and kills which is just nonsense. you cant change all playstyles, they are automatically repeating accidently by players. there are more aggressive (ricky) and more defensive (fau) players. and there are players which always be last and runaway (hello ami) did you notice that rail is the only thing where he does decent dmg? did you notice that it doesnt matter if he rails like 2 players while 5 are attacking him and the rest of his team is dead? no because you are clueless. you watch his stats and think that such rails are amazing... backward rails are the most easy to deliver but who do i tell that?...

you are talking about ted and cpm4 for 10v10 or something like that. those were designed for tdm 4v4! and they work very well, they are perfect for your 5v5 freezetag. is it really a surprise that we win such maps while we have at least 4 or 5 players who played tdm competetive like 10 or more years ago?
same for dm7 and i just can tell you that it would have been a lot more faster game if i would have been able to talk and give infos/callouts what to do. mates decided to take it slow and guess what, everyone was following this orders. think about to tell ricky to stay calm at any position... he will not follow that order i bet!

i also want to say that we werent even in shape or had any practice with any of that lineup together. i wasnt even playing quake anytime because im caught to baldurs gate 3 lastly.
your guys even trained vs BOTS! and it wasnt still enough

and lastly about your talking about our team overall. i just repeat it again. there are teams which are way more stronger in case of potential/aiming etc. out there. the only thing we use is our experience and brains. our aiming is limited cause of age and reaction time, we are just outplaying any teams, because we just watched how they play and took a gameplan vs them which was mostly succesfull. its not about how to play maps or what you do at specific maps. its about your team chemistry overall and the weakness of any other team and how to deny their strength which we read pretty well i would say.

you had the better players but the worst coach yesterday. high aim, low brain. matches to many players there.

finally some quote

salami2.png

nothing more to say mvp.

"the better team always wins" right cTh?

[-=ASS=-RICKY!!!]

Bro that is so cool and everything but, and here is a big but,we do not really care,we played the way we played,i have to admit,i may have played less than i wanted to but still,we played those fights more for entertaining purposes and nothing else,wow a cool fight we have a ultimate mega giga chad fight 2023 and all the top unfreeze players assembled and yes you guys played great,ggs on my end,it is just a fight we played good and you simply played better and next time around who knows, maybe we will win,we dont play for money,and even less so for fame,we play because we love the game and this little competition that adminless organizes every year is something that also gets this community together,nothing more nothing less,nobody won a million dollars or something,you guys were more clutch than us and that's it,great games and i hope in the future admin will organize a spring cup just like the one we had last summer so we can have something to do and hopefully make it an annual event,spring and summer knockout tournaments and than unfreeze league to cap off the year,i look forward to play against you guys someday,merry christmas to those who celebrate orthodox christmas and happy holidays to the rest of you,see you around

[adminless]

@kf lol talks about brains the guy that couldn't even communicate a block in time after more than a week because he literally had zero brain cells left from over drinking during the holidays. ok buddy as I see you're not only full of shit when you sign up for/participate in something that also even when you actually win it. I don't recall anybody from team UnFreeZe asking for your opinion and/or your advice here so in what concerns me all that I see that you just came to do here is to keep talking more none sense shit and picking up flame wars which I'm not gonna engage with as I said yesterday and I mean it so the event is already over and pretty much all that you had to bring here (i.e. to make the fight happen) you already have so now be gone until next time if it's that it happens to be another one.

@ricky mate do not waste your time and energy explaining yourself to some random troll that isn't looking for anything else beside some attention and drama. there's zero needs to get triggered like that, trust me. well played yesterday and sure looking forward future events within us or against these guys or whatever happens as usual, we'll see.

[PacMan]

Q would beat them .....

[adminless]

ok finally all done and reviewed now, inside videos up since this morning as they were being produced during the night and the YouTube ones uploaded along the evening as the whole thing took a bit more time than usual since it was a long (and great) fight and it had to be made twice (once for the inside videos and another one for YouTube). as for the fight itself probably not much to comment that hasn't already been said. clearly the strengths of both teams were well known since the beginning and lied in top skill/offense in one hand (UnFreeZe) and pretty much teamplay and experience in the other (Diamond) as expected from a team that had just came from finishing a entire season playing virtually every game with the same formation and some players that have been playing Quake III Arena since it came out more than 20 years ago (I don't even think it takes a genius to see that). that's why each team made the picks they did and that clearly reflected as well in the game with diamond growing in the second half as the fighting became more tactical. UnFreeZe best chances and hopes were probably for a quick 3:0 win that was just a few rounds (2:0 | 7:7) from materializing with superb performances in the two opening games where they made virtually no mistakes. unfortunately for team UnFreeZe it did not happen and despite their great efforts diamond managed somehow, probably with more heart/faith than anything, to stop UnFreeZe in the later rounds of the third to make it to a very favorable fourth game where they clearly outmatched team UnFreeZe. the actual tie-breaker of the fight was q3dm7 where diamond finally displayed their most tactical game and experience to end up taking a overall neck to neck fight in the combined scorecards. as said, I think that it did not fail to deliver and it was a top showdown between two s tier teams. I think this time there was pretty much nobody left. probably for another occasion since I saw the engagement was high another more competitive format like a legged one can be played provided that it ends up happening as usual. obviously this is only once a year or so kind of fights, it's not like I'm gonna get involved like this in a regular basis but provided the circumstances are right I think it would be a good idea to make it all over again after another main event so we'll see.

in terms of balance I think the overall stats speaks by themselves better than anything so as can be seen I assembled a s tier team (UnFreeZe) to fight another s tier team (diamond) and not a a tier team (immortal) for example. that's exactly the way it should generally be if possible. besides that just for reference as I made a (unintended) quick calculation before now that the results are more or less uniform this is what you currently get from that "skill" metric that the people liked for each team:

• Team UnFreeZe:
  • WhoAmI: 1931.2 points
  • Infin!ty: 1680.8 points
  • Blaze: 1639.0 points
  • aimer: 1619.8 points
  • Fus1on: 1619.6 points
  • fau: 1613.9 points
  • ironmonkey: 1607.1 points
  • RICKY: 1593.4 points
  • avg: 1663.1 points
• Diamond Clan:
  • olc: 1805.2 points
  • kf: 1698.3 points
  • Miroslav: 1662.1 points
  • HEERO: 1650.3 points
  • Shantu: 1497.1 points
  • avg: 1662.6 points

I assume that should finally settle that dispute for good and tell all that needed to be told about that fair-play/balance topic. now I'll just move this to its respective sub-forum as usual and that should be all thank you everyone for participate and epic games, well played. for the rest now that I see that the topic is hot and the interest is high may be this January instead of trying to organize another kind of event (i.e. ctf/ffa/duel) finally a community game can be organized just like these weeks team UnFreeZe training only now with fully fairly computed teams not "everyone" versus team UnFreeZe. as usual we'll see so stay tuned.

[fau]

first of all... good games, well played by all (besides one ofcourse)
(...)

@kf you had a chance to show some class and stop after first sentence, but instead decided to talk shit about basically everyone involved...

high aim, low brain. matches to many players there.

For a bright side I can tell you that we had fun, spirits were great on voice and this is not gonna spoil it. It's not all about you, you know. We just enjoyed playing together in such unusual lineups. If you have some problem with adminless or ami then talk to them directly, because I asked Ricky and others to play for fun and they did nothing to deserve this treatment.

About dm7 - I had these delusions many times in the past. If we can just have good strategy and stay focused, we can play it active. But it has been 3 years and it was proven again and again that it just never works when one team decides to camp and does it well. We're not pro teams practicing strategies 5 days a week. Let's just stick to maps that play good without extreme team coordination (and idea that good coordination would fix camping dm7 is only hypothetical, show me one game where it was actually done). I didn't criticize olc, he did what he should have done. Just how boring the map was to watch on gtv.

[adminless]

yeah, as said, don't stress over it that I already banned the guy here in the forum since now that the thing has ended he is not really gonna do anything else here beside throwing yet another shit show and a circus that I'm not gonna allow. if in the future it would happen to be a rematch and/or anything else at another occasion he could have been just unbanned here in the forum to participate. that said, I'm glad these guys (in general not just him) bring these kind of things in public and that's also part of the reason of why the forum is there for so people can see for themselves what this is really about and make up their own minds instead of just getting one intoxicated side of the story as I know from experience these are the same kind of guys that write you all that same shit in private as you're saying and later go around accusing you of all the crazy-making, not answering, no listening, ripping people off, banning people for no reason and so on and on instead.

as for the maps as I said, I think it will be evaluated the next time another event gets proposed and it will also depend on the circumstances. whatever the case is, I think the argument about hardcore tdm based maps for UnFreeZe has already been brought (and answered) other times already even at discussions about the pubs. you just can't compare a gametype where you spawn with pretty much nothing and that you need to navigate in full to stock you from a gametype where you already spawn with pretty much everything. that's not even to mention about power ups and the standard quad and suit (i.e. not even rocket jumps) setups. as said, those are things that I don't even think that are necessary to be answered (i.e. obviousness that everyone already know) hence why I'm not gonna waste my time in any of that.

[PacMan]

first of all... good games, well played by all (besides one ofcourse)
(...)

@kf you had a chance to show some class and stop after first sentence, but instead decided to talk shit about basically everyone involved...

high aim, low brain. matches to many players there.

For a bright side I can tell you that we had fun, spirits were great on voice and this is not gonna spoil it. It's not all about you, you know. We just enjoyed playing together in such unusual lineups. If you have some problem with adminless or ami then talk to them directly, because I asked Ricky and others to play for fun and they did nothing to deserve this treatment.

About dm7 - I had these delusions many times in the past. If we can just have good strategy and stay focused, we can play it active. But it has been 3 years and it was proven again and again that it just never works when one team decides to camp and does it well. We're not pro teams practicing strategies 5 days a week. Let's just stick to maps that play good without extreme team coordination (and idea that good coordination would fix camping dm7 is only hypothetical, show me one game where it was actually done). I didn't criticize olc, he did what he should have done. Just how boring the map was to watch on gtv.

To keep things fun , you know he right about Ricky the rooster blood power

[fernandinho1337]

as chat on the server was muted on behalf of all the players of DC/ immortal: gg to the guys who played for team unfreeze!

best,

[FraG_MasiN]

[adminless]

hehe I see that you all really liked it, yes, I think it was huge and the hype was real. as said, come one of you (it doesn't necessarily have to be kf) the next time that something happens and if not all the guys are interested/available/make it to participate at least I'll look forward make it all over again (i.e. with the same team and/or with changes depending in circumstances we'll see).